MSNBC "Hardball with Chris Matthews" - Transcript: Border Crisis

Interview

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Judge Clay Jenkins was part of the group of local leaders that met with President Obama just yesterday down in Texas. He`s the highest elected official in Dallas County down there. And of course Eugene Robinson is sitting with me. He`s the Pulitzer Prize-winning columnist with "The Washington Post."

Judge, you heard what I said. Why the diddling around with this? Why the politics? On this particular case, the law is clear. These kids at least deserve a hearing. In the meantime, they deserve to be treated like kids who are innocent until proven guilty of something. Why can`t the Democrats and the Republicans -- well, let`s go at it -- the Republicans play ball here, pass the money needed to handle this situation and get it over with?

CLAY JENKINS, DALLAS COUNTY JUDGE: I don`t know. If the Texas delegation -- and we`re the most affected state in the union by this. If they would stand up to secure our borders and to treat these kids with some compassion and we stood unified and voted for that supplement, it would pass and we could do it next week.
And I hope that we will because you`re absolutely right. There is no real difference. We all believe that we need to secure the border. We all believe that we need to improve conditions in these countries where these children will be returning to, most of them. And we all believe that children here in America deserve compassionate care and a humanitarian response.

There`s no good reason for Congress not to do their part.

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MATTHEWS: Well, let me go back to -- let me go back to Judge Clay (sic) on that. It seems to me there ought to be some reckoning here. You could say it`s Obama`s fault because he`s been easier on deporting kids of a certain age. OK. But apparently, the big the draw down there is the reality if they get these kids to the border, they`re entitled to a hearing so you (ph) could take two years, and perhaps during that time, they could find a way (ph) to residence (ph) in our country.

There`s a number of magnets, if you will, for kids to be sent up here by their parents from countries where it`s a hell-hole to live in.

JENKINS: Well, you know, what difference does it make whose fault it is? we`re leaders. We all have a role to play. Congress`s role is to pass that supplemental appropriation so that we`ll have the tools that we need to end this humanitarian crisis.

Our role here in Dallas County is we`ve offered facilities and compassionate care for 2,000 children, so we can double the capacity that the federal government now has at their Air Force and military bases throughout this country just in our county.

Surely, on this, on the issue of securing our border and treating children like human beings -- surely, on this, they can come to the table and we can get this passed.

MATTHEWS: What`s the -- can you speak for the community down there? I mean, you`re an elected official. Can you speak for the community down there in Dallas? I know it`s a conservative city. It always has been. But what`s the view of the people of what we should do as a country with these refugees?

JENKINS: Well, the view in Dallas County has been overwhelmingly that these children are not others, they are children like your children and my children, and that they deserve to be treated with human compassion. And so from the faith community, many of whom are conservative and vote Republican, I haven`t had a single minister or rabbi or faith leader of any sect not be in favor of this who`s contacted me.

Now, I have been contacted by thousands of people from across this country who feel that these children are others, had them called "human garbage" that should be thrown away. But that wouldn`t be the mindset of the overwhelming majority of the people who live here.

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MATTHEWS: Late today, Arizona senator John McCain, along with his fellow senator, Jeff Flake, took their shot at compromise. They announced a plan to introduce legislation that would, among other things, change the 2008 law which gives extralegal protections to unaccompanied children coming from Central America.

It talks about things like alternatives to detention, like ankle monitors to make sure people show up to their immigration court hearings. And it increases the number of refugee visas for countries like El Salvador, Honduras and Ecuador, where violence and gangs run rampant.What do you make of that, Judge?

JENKINS: These -- I`ve been down, and I`m one of the few people who`ve actually seen these children. And these are children. They are children like any other group of children. But they -- these children are terrified. They`re dirty. They`re a thousand miles away from their parents. And right now, they`re living in cells, where there are 30 children, that were designed for six adults. They`ve all got to go to the bathroom in front of each other.

What those children need is they need to be moved to someplace like Dallas County temporarily so that people can show them that they`re valued as human beings, that they`re loved and that they`re not prisoners, they`re children.

Putting an ankle bracelet on a child so that the child is made to feel like a criminal is one of the most inhumane things that I can think of doing to a small child. And I think the people that are proposing that are people that still see these children as something different than what they are, which are children made in the image of God, just like every other child here in the United States.

MATTHEWS: What wonderful words you just spoke there. I can`t beat that. Thank you, Judge Clay Jenkins, for joining us from Dallas County. And Eugene Robinson, as always. It`s hard to keep up with that eloquence.

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